READ THIS!

Welcome to the Therian Guide forums.

You really have to follow these instructions! Instructions will update as you progress.

If you wish to post on, or access most of the content of our forum and our community, please click here to register first, then follow the instructions below. If you have already registered, please log in, in the above "Hello There, Guest!" box.

Thanks for understanding and see you around.



Post Reply 
Correct usage of "I identify as"
DustWolf
Member is Offline
the wolf in blue
Theriotype: Canis Lupus, Wolf
Experience: Therian
Connection: Psychological
Reputation: 303
Contribution: tick tick tick 
tick tick tick 
tick 
silvertick silvertick silvertick 
silvertick silvertick silvertick 
silvertick 

.
Post: #1
Correct usage of "I identify as"
Hello,

I previously wrote this in a slightly longer thread, deeper within the guts of our forums, but I thought it might be worthwhile to make a shorter one, with a clearer message here, so that more people are likely to see and understand it.

So, regarding how "I identify as" tends to be used in the therian community.


When used as a noun, "identify" seems to imply an action. You identify, therefore you are actively doing something. This is somewhat of a misconception because of what identity is.

In mathematics, identity is usually depicted with a diagram like this:
[Image: identity%20matrix0.png]

This diagram means that an identity of something is exactly the same as that something in every way, applied to the therian case:
[Image: identity%20matrix1.png]

The numbers represent whether or not something matches or not, with one being where both Reality and Perception are supposed to be the same in a certain way:
[Image: identity%20matrix2.png]
...and zero being the case where Perception and Reality cannot differ in some way:
[Image: identity%20matrix3.png]


In other words, your identity is You. If you are a wolf therian, saying that you identify as a wolf is nonsense. Your identity is "wolf therian" or rather in a more broader sense "You".

I don't identify as a wolf. Don't get me wrong, I really wish I was a wolf, but I'm not a wolf. I'm a wolf therian. I am not delusional and I want my statements to make sense. My identity is me, I cannot choose for it to be something else. If it is something else, then it is not my identity. Because my identity can only be the same as me in every way.

Before you say the meaning of words change. (Click to View)

Before you plug your ears and say "LA LA LA LA" loudly. (Click to View)


You can if you want to, require other people to refer to you as X. You can force them to use the pronouns you have chosen for yourself, because it is literately the law*. You can choose to hide from reality and make Therianthropy a little fantasy bubble that you can be safe in. It doesn't change anything about what you are going to have to face in life.

The thing is, You are probably more complex as a person, than just one phrase or thing or tribe of people. You're You, you are unique, and you do get to choose who you want to be, through your choices and actions in life, in Reality.

Don't try to make us see you as something you are not. Earn it. Do it for real.

LP,
Dusty

Most problems are man-made.

[Image: therapy%20wolf.png]
(This post was last modified: 2020-02-26 11:43 by DustWolf.)
2020-02-26 11:41
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Wisteria Equidae
Member is Offline
Pup
Theriotype: Hanoverian horse
Experience: Therian
Connection: Psychological, Spiritual
Reputation: 5
Contribution:

.
Post: #2
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
It makes sense, actually. But I feel like people shouldn't be forced to (if that even happens) to say that they identify as an X therian. I doubt it is something physical for anyone and they would think that they actually are an animal by using "Identify as animal". I personally feel like "identify as animal" would only be more confusing for non-otherkin (umbrella).
But this really makes sense, and I'm glad you thought about it.

[Image: Untitled2-20200223210920.png]
2020-02-26 13:12
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Misha
Member is Offline
A Featherless Biped
Theriotype: Hyacinth macaw
Experience: Therian
Connection: Psychological
Reputation: 29
Contribution: tick tick tick 

.
Post: #3
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
You make a good argument. But I think you have made the mistake of applying a mathematical definition of a word to a field (psychology/sociology) outside the scope of mathematics. Identity is used in a slightly different way in these fields.

I say I identify as a hyacinth macaw, but I understand if that feels awkward to you.

I find the term therian awkward to use. So I tend to avoid it.

Fluffy hyacinth macaw to the core with the power of a human brain! cawsmile

My blood belongs to the sea, my heart the sky, and my brain the cosmos

"I would rather spend my life close to the birds than waste it wishing I had wings" - from House, M.D.
2020-02-26 13:34
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
DustWolf
Member is Offline
the wolf in blue
Theriotype: Canis Lupus, Wolf
Experience: Therian
Connection: Psychological
Reputation: 303
Contribution: tick tick tick 
tick tick tick 
tick 
silvertick silvertick silvertick 
silvertick silvertick silvertick 
silvertick 

.
Post: #4
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
(2020-02-26 13:34)Voltavius Wrote:  You make a good argument. But I think you have made the mistake of applying a mathematical definition of a word to a field (psychology/sociology) outside the scope of mathematics. Identity is used in a slightly different way in these fields.

It is an example used to describe a concept. The word identity means pretty much the same thing in all fields, but in the case of Mathematics, I can show you a diagram that you can also find using Google.

(2020-02-26 13:34)Voltavius Wrote:  I say I identify as a hyacinth macaw, but I understand if that feels awkward to you.

I find the term therian awkward to use. So I tend to avoid it.

It is more than confusing: It is wrong and it creates a world of problems when you discuss things like social identity, etc, when the contradictions no longer make any sense. This is discussed in more details in the linked thread as well as the original thread made by @Tdae.

TL;DR, see post above.

LP,
Dusty

Most problems are man-made.

[Image: therapy%20wolf.png]
(This post was last modified: 2020-02-26 13:47 by DustWolf.)
2020-02-26 13:46
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Syraphin Faelad
Away
Creature
Theriotype: Demon wolf
Experience: Therian, Otherkin
Connection: Psychological, Spiritual
Reputation: 25
Contribution: tick tick tick 
tick 

.
Post: #5
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
Does it really matter?

People can call themselves what they like. If they chose to be ignorant or not fully understand the full meaning behind words. That's fine. Besides always an exception to rule and you cant really use mathematics to explain behaviours because by definition many are illogical.

Stressing over the usage of a single fraze seems counter productive. Focus on other parts of theranthropy, there is plenty to choose from.
2020-02-26 14:13
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
elinox
Member is Offline
Blaidd Drwg
Theriotype: Lupine & Feline
Experience: Therian, Otherkin
Connection: Psychological, Spiritual
Reputation: 148
Contribution: tick tick tick 
tick tick 

.
Post: #6
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
I think the "identify as" phrasing came about simply because stating "I am a wolf" was met with criticism and harsh disbelief because we're not actually physically non-human creatures. So it was a way to phrase the concept better for people who are not 'kin and thus don't "get it" like those within the community or those who actually experience it do.

Either way, "I identify as a wolf" and "I am a wolf" equates to the same thing. We're really just splitting semantic hairs. Tongue

[Image: 2rhxWjw.png]
lupine (werewolf) & cat | 38 | writer & published author | scuba diver | chaotic good | Hufflepuff | INFP | eclectic Wiccan witch
2020-02-26 14:19
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Saoirse Fiain
Member is Offline
Fiáin Mac tíre
Theriotype: Lycanthrope
Experience: Therian, (otherkin?)
Connection: Psychological, Spiritual
Reputation: 32
Contribution: tick tick 

.
Post: #7
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
Going off of what Eli said, I'm pretty sure that the phrases "I am a wolf" and "I identify as a wolf" are on the metaphorical side. I suppose people began to use the phrases without much thought and in a more literal sense. I'll admit that I fell into the latter, but after being in the community for more time now I don't necessarily agree with the term, but I won't stop people from using it. The word "Identity" is used so much, not just in the therian/kin communities, that it's pretty much losing it's meaning.

"Listen to them - the children of the night. What music they make!"
- Bram Stoker

2020-02-26 18:59
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Wisteria Equidae
Member is Offline
Pup
Theriotype: Hanoverian horse
Experience: Therian
Connection: Psychological, Spiritual
Reputation: 5
Contribution:

.
Post: #8
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
(2020-02-26 18:59)Rolling_Pinelog Wrote:  Going off of what Eli said, I'm pretty sure that the phrases "I am a wolf" and "I identify as a wolf" are on the metaphorical side. I suppose people began to use the phrases without much thought and in a more literal sense. I'll admit that I fell into the latter, but after being in the community for more time now I don't necessarily agree with the term, but I won't stop people from using it. The word "Identity" is used so much, not just in the therian/kin communities, that it's pretty much losing it's meaning.

I completely agree. I feel like it is unnecessary to change anything, identity has been an important word here for years. I wouldn't call it the correct or the incorrect way of things, the definitions are the ones generally accepted and not facts that we cannot change.

[Image: Untitled2-20200223210920.png]
2020-02-26 19:26
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Tdae
Member is Offline
Eager beaver
Theriotype: Wolf
Experience: (therian?)
Connection: Psychological
Reputation: 14
Contribution: tick 

.
Post: #9
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
Good point @DustWolf. Indeed, something I struggle with. If I say "I am a wolf," it is unreality. It matters because it is important to know the difference between what is real and what isn't. Identity could be understood metaphorically until people start getting triggered over their identity. If people are getting triggered it means they have trauma-brain and not in control of their mind.

(2020-02-26 14:13)Syraphin Faelad Wrote:  Does it really matter?

People can call themselves what they like. If they chose to be ignorant or not fully understand the full meaning behind words. That's fine. Besides always an exception to rule and you cant really use mathematics to explain behaviours because by definition many are illogical.

Stressing over the usage of a single fraze seems counter productive. Focus on other parts of theranthropy, there is plenty to choose from.

I think it matters because language shapes perceptions and people could get dazed with identity stuff. Mostly I think behaviors are logical or can be explained logically if one understands how the mind works. There is also the element of creative chaos though too. But the mind is like a machine and it can be controlled like a machine under some circumstances. The unconscious mind is more vulnerable. If someone is not interacting with reality, not in control of their mind, then they're easier to fool or control.
(This post was last modified: 2020-02-27 1:30 by Tdae.)
2020-02-27 1:26
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
LycanTheory
Member is Offline
Doggo
Theriotype: Shepherd dog
Experience: Therian, (otherkin?)
Reputation: 351
Contribution: tick tick tick 
tick tick tick 
silvertick silvertick silvertick 
silvertick silvertick 

.
Post: #10
RE: Correct usage of "I identify as"
(2020-02-26 14:19)elinox Wrote:  Either way, "I identify as a wolf" and "I am a wolf" equates to the same thing. We're really just splitting semantic hairs. Tongue

Welcome to therianthropy Laugh

I feel similar, Eli. Outside of those rare instances where someone is genuinely curious to the depth and details of my therian experience, I'm simply trying to convey the gist or general idea of what it means to be therian to someone.

"I identity as", "I feel I am", "To some degree, I am more x than y". Whatever works, they're all interchangeable as long as they get the job done.

Lyc

[Image: Lycan.png]
"It takes incredible strength and courage to be different from everybody else, but it's a good thing."
2020-02-27 7:46
Save
Quote
Give Thanks
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)